Please start any new threads on our new
site at https://forums.sqlteam.com. We've got lots of great SQL Server
experts to answer whatever question you can come up with.
| Author |
Topic |
|
tribune
Posting Yak Master
105 Posts |
 Posted - 2002-05-07 : 20:34:34
|
| I'm looking around for a really good (and somewhat advanced) book on data modeling and logical data structure. I noticed SQLTeam doesnt really have any for this subject - only for programming - and sql-server-performance.com has soem really outdated ones that arent too advanced. Anyone have any advice? Thanks in advancePS Sorry if this question is in the wrong forum but its the only one I found suitable :) |
|
|
robvolk
Most Valuable Yak
15732 Posts |
Posted - 2002-05-07 : 21:52:01
|
| Chris Date's books are probably the most advanced ones on database design and theory. Some of the older ones that are now in a second edition are hallmarks (according to the reviews I've read, the one book of his that I leafed through gave me a headache!) I wouldn't say that being old/outdated is bad; good database design concepts have been around for quite a while, anything written in the last 10-15 years is still relevant today. In fact, I would suggest that an older book might be better, simply because it had to deal with database products nowhere near as powerful as today's offerings, so good design was crucial to good performance (a bad design would show up much more quickly back then) If you look at Chris Date's books, look for related titles by Hugh Darwen, they've collaborated a few times.I've found that Ken Henderson's books are superb (The Guru's Guides, both of them), Inside SQL Server 6.5 by Ron Soukup was excellent. He covered table design very briefly, but very authoritatively, and from a purely practical standpoint (Inside SQL Server 7.0 probably has the same chapter, I don't know about SQL 2000). One of the things I don't like about Chris Date's stuff is that he doesn't address practical considerations and exalts theoretical ideals to a fault; in his opinion, anything less than 5th Normal Form is blasphemy (I could be reading it wrong, but I'm not exaggerating the religious fervor part!) Joe Celko's books also cover table design, but not exclusively.A personal recommendation, feel free to ignore it: don't assume that reading Chris Date or Hugh Darwen or Joe Celko's musings on table design will lead to a design nirvana that solves the meaning of the universe. If you understand the ideas behind the degrees of data normalization:http://www.sqlteam.com/redir.asp?ItemID=7022...and any other design examples that you find in most books and documentation, you'll have 95% of what you need to know. If you are designing working databases for a living, that's all you'll need. If you're writing a thesis, then spending $60-$80 on a specialized, university-level database design textbook may give you the last 5%, but it may not. I'd recommend getting your hands on the book in the bookstore and spend an hour or two with it before you buy it. |
 |
|
|
Merkin
Funky Drop Bear Fearing SQL Dude!
4970 Posts |
Posted - 2002-05-07 : 22:11:41
|
| Also, for a practical, hands on SQL Server book. I belive the Wrox "Designing SQL 2000 Databases" book is very good.It covers modelling principles, normal forms, theory etc in the first section, then has a practicle section where it translates those things to SQL Server tables, views, contraints and stored procedures.It is a little pricy (especially in Australia where all computer books are expensive) but seems to be very good.There was a sample chapter floating around somewhere explaining normalisation that was very good, I used it do give some in house training to some co-workers.Damian |
|
|
|
tribune
Posting Yak Master
105 Posts |
Posted - 2002-05-08 : 03:38:52
|
| Merkin, I'm actually thinking about purchasing "Professional SQL Server 2000 Database Design" by Davidson just because its a wrox title and I've read Robert Vierra's "sql server 2000 programming" and found it really helpful!robvolk, you're probably right about how some of the design books wont lead to "design nirvana", as I've designed about three small databases (50 or so tables each) with only reading robert's book which very briefly covers normalization (about 45 pages) so it certainly didnt require any special study of theory on my part :) Which of Chris Date's/Hugh Darwen/Joe Celko book's in particular do you own? I did a search on amazon, and found:Relational Database Writings, 1985-1989 Relational Database Writings, 1989-1991 Relational Database Writings, 1994-1997 Foundation for Object / Relational Databases: The Third Manifesto Foundation for Future Database Systems: The Third ManifestoThe Database Relational Model : A Retrospective Review and Analysis : A Historical Account and Assessment of E. F. Codd's Contribution to the FieldJoe Celko's Data & Databases : Concepts in Practice (Morgan Kaufmann Series in Data Management Systems)Thanks again! |
|
|
|
byrmol
Shed Building SQL Farmer
1591 Posts |
Posted - 2002-05-08 : 04:19:44
|
Tribune,For what it's worth.. I own:>Foundation for Future Database Systems: The Third Manifesto Not for a beginner or intermediate users.... Intense stuff indeedThis is the second edition of "Foundation for Object / Relational Databases: The Third Manifesto">The Database Relational Model : A Retrospective Review and >Analysis : A Historical Account and Assessment of E. F. Codd's >Contribution to the Field A fantastic summary of the work done by Codd and its impact on the database world. Neither of those books outline Database Design....Chris Date's "Relational Database Writings" also do not cover design..I don't own any Celko books but he is definately the type of author you should be looking for.. Fantastic at the practical level...For an all round good book on databases in general, you cannot go past "An Introduction to Database Systems" 7th Edition - Chris Date.Just about all the theory you can poke a stick at.. If I remember properly about 100+ pages on normalisation.. Not much on design patterns though..If you ask me, once you know the fundamentals of normalisation, designing logical models becomes fairly easy...I always find the hard part of design is the bloody Client.. Make up your mind dammit!!!!! DavidM"SQL-3 is an abomination.." |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Good books for a data modeling developer?